Do we credit readers with brains? - CrimeSpace2024-03-29T16:02:03Zhttp://crimespace.ning.com/forum/topics/do-we-credit-readers-with-1?commentId=537324%3AComment%3A307372&feed=yes&xn_auth=noKnow who gives readers credit…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-08-02:537324:Comment:3078992011-08-02T21:24:47.116ZCammy May Hunnicutthttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>Know who gives readers credit for brains?</p>
<p>Zombies.</p>
<p>But they don't take Mastercard.</p>
<p>Know who gives readers credit for brains?</p>
<p>Zombies.</p>
<p>But they don't take Mastercard.</p> Know what I think's hilarious…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-08-02:537324:Comment:3078982011-08-02T21:23:55.424ZCammy May Hunnicutthttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>Know what I think's hilarious? People who correct your pronunciation of Latin.</p>
<p>Nobody has heard a native Latin speaker speak for thousands of years, but they'll tell you how to say it like they just saw a Roman talk show.</p>
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<p>My sister thought her brat was going to Medical school (instead of the veternary assistant/homewrecker she turned out to be) and was telling her she needed to take Latin so she'd have a leg up on anatomy and DocSpeak. I told her best take…</p>
<p>Know what I think's hilarious? People who correct your pronunciation of Latin.</p>
<p>Nobody has heard a native Latin speaker speak for thousands of years, but they'll tell you how to say it like they just saw a Roman talk show.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>My sister thought her brat was going to Medical school (instead of the veternary assistant/homewrecker she turned out to be) and was telling her she needed to take Latin so she'd have a leg up on anatomy and DocSpeak. I told her best take Spanish, which does the same thing and also might help her get a job...like in a Miami gunshot OR ward or something. Which, for once, she took my advice on.</p>
<p>My brother Pow said, "Well, in that case, might as well take Vietnamese."</p> Thanks I.J. and I like your l…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-08-02:537324:Comment:3078972011-08-02T20:41:03.639ZMeghttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Meg
<p>Thanks I.J. and I like your levity, Cammy.</p>
<p>Some of this is coming home to me in quite the ironic way as I sis through our workshops. At the beginning of each session the leader discusses some vocab we might not have used/heard of. This morning, there was an open discussion that those who had Latin had the advantage, and sure enough they knew most of them and I was not in that group. Ah well.</p>
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<p>Thanks I.J. and I like your levity, Cammy.</p>
<p>Some of this is coming home to me in quite the ironic way as I sis through our workshops. At the beginning of each session the leader discusses some vocab we might not have used/heard of. This morning, there was an open discussion that those who had Latin had the advantage, and sure enough they knew most of them and I was not in that group. Ah well.</p>
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<p> </p> I've been thinking about the…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3076172011-07-31T22:34:36.612ZCammy May Hunnicutthttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>I've been thinking about the "competition" thing, though, and there is something to it. Maybe 50 years ago people got up from dinner and read books or sang around the piano, whereas now many of them watch TV.</p>
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<p>But it's not "competition" in the normal sense of the word. It's habit and lifestyle. It's not like you can write this super-wonderful book that will cause people to read it instead of watching their favorite soap, then what's on next. That's habitual.</p>
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<p>I've been thinking about the "competition" thing, though, and there is something to it. Maybe 50 years ago people got up from dinner and read books or sang around the piano, whereas now many of them watch TV.</p>
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<p>But it's not "competition" in the normal sense of the word. It's habit and lifestyle. It's not like you can write this super-wonderful book that will cause people to read it instead of watching their favorite soap, then what's on next. That's habitual.</p>
<p> </p> I don't think people read cri…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3076162011-07-31T22:32:00.165ZCammy May Hunnicutthttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>I don't think people read crime novels to get educated. And anything poetic or gripping along the way is all part of the entertainment.</p>
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<p>I think it's wrong to look at fiction as "merely entertaining". That what we do and shouldn't downgrade it. Whether a book stuffed full of facts about Victorian Englands flash class is more entertaining than a studly private eye knocking them out and knocking them up is all based on what readers find enjoyable.</p>
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<p>I…</p>
<p>I don't think people read crime novels to get educated. And anything poetic or gripping along the way is all part of the entertainment.</p>
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<p>I think it's wrong to look at fiction as "merely entertaining". That what we do and shouldn't downgrade it. Whether a book stuffed full of facts about Victorian Englands flash class is more entertaining than a studly private eye knocking them out and knocking them up is all based on what readers find enjoyable.</p>
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<p>I stipulated on the "brain activity" thing. I just don't think it matters. Swimming or weightlifting might be better body exercise than sex, but who cares? </p>
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<p>I guess I see this kind of like the "if you've got a message for people go to Western Union" thing, kind of, if you want to educate, write non-fiction. But again, I just don't see any higher purpose crime fiction serves than entertaining people. </p>
<p>Nor should it. Nor should it be dissed for it.</p> Cammy, I don't think anyone h…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3076132011-07-31T21:36:26.607ZJames Fouchehttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JamesFouche
<p>Cammy, I don't think anyone here claims to be brainier than anyone else. In fact, I find myself boasting about my shortcomings as an author. I suck at odd things and sometimes struggle to find certain words or confuse them with others. I hope we all do. I frequently say that writers can't write - they tell stories. I'm not trying to be superior at all. If you knew me personally you'd fall off your chair if I suddenly proclaimed to be superior. I'm an ass at times, but that's not why I asked…</p>
<p>Cammy, I don't think anyone here claims to be brainier than anyone else. In fact, I find myself boasting about my shortcomings as an author. I suck at odd things and sometimes struggle to find certain words or confuse them with others. I hope we all do. I frequently say that writers can't write - they tell stories. I'm not trying to be superior at all. If you knew me personally you'd fall off your chair if I suddenly proclaimed to be superior. I'm an ass at times, but that's not why I asked if we credit readers with brains.</p>
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<p>But tell me, how can I take myself seriously as an author if I don't try my best to perfect what I do? We are writers. We use the English language to tell stories. In order to understand where we are going, we need to know where we're from. Hence the need to catch up on a bit of Shakespeare or Twain or anything in that wide sphere of literary perfection. Like art students studying Picasso or Rembrandt. Do you just write for the sake of writing? Do you not love the thrill of expressing yourself as best you could?</p>
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<p>To prove my point, read some of the replies sent - even this one or the one you sent - and see the many spelling errors or grammatical flaws. As I write this reply I feel myself searching for the right word at the right place, because I want to express myself without offending anyone.</p>
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<p>But we digress again. You really made the point of this discussion when you used the example of a different country and using their lingo without spelling it out for the reader. I was searching for examples of what I tried to say and you found it!! In South Africa "Kiss my poephol!" means exactly what you would think it means. If I have to explain it to the reader it means I don't credit him with brains, right?</p>
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<p>So, full circle, as you explained it best with your earlier reply, we should refrain from treating readers like illiterate children. I share your view, but stress that we as authors should strive to accomplish something with our writing other than just entertaining them.</p>
Cammy, crime fiction can be…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3076012011-07-31T21:03:41.376ZJames Fouchehttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JamesFouche
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<p>Cammy, crime fiction can be entertaining while being informative and educational. And there is a link to writing good crime fiction novels and using the TV as a collaborative tool.</p>
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<p>Have you read Lynda La Plante? She writes a tight-yet-glossy crime novel. It's entertaining and has a slack measure in dialogue and style, but she has a tightly-edited approach and she can be poetic when she wants. However, she has received numerous awards for her contribution to TV shows…</p>
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<p>Cammy, crime fiction can be entertaining while being informative and educational. And there is a link to writing good crime fiction novels and using the TV as a collaborative tool.</p>
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<p>Have you read Lynda La Plante? She writes a tight-yet-glossy crime novel. It's entertaining and has a slack measure in dialogue and style, but she has a tightly-edited approach and she can be poetic when she wants. However, she has received numerous awards for her contribution to TV shows like Prime Suspect.</p>
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<p>Unfortunately studies have shown that reading is the best brain exercise. TV - very little stimulation, I'm afraid. You can either google or research it yourself. It's the discipline of word, sentence, paragraph, page and - and this is the important one - information.</p>
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<p>When I write a sentence of people dying in a rockfall, my research of the location, the feasibility of a rockfall and any previous incidents at the location, forces a lot of info into that one sentence. The reader has to take it in and subliminally records and considers everything. TV viewing stresses the eye muscles more than the brain.</p>
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<p>j</p> No guarantees? Damn! Now y…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3075932011-07-31T17:00:48.429ZCammy May Hunnicutthttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
No guarantees? Damn! Now you tell me. :-)
No guarantees? Damn! Now you tell me. :-) You're OK, Meg. :)tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3075612011-07-31T13:57:28.778ZI. J. Parkerhttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
You're OK, Meg. :)
You're OK, Meg. :) I'm not trying to start somet…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2011-07-31:537324:Comment:3075862011-07-31T10:55:08.741ZMeghttp://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Meg
<p>I'm not trying to start something with this, or continue it, whatever. I'm an old lady with opinions and experiences, and yes, some of my experiences are also in Hollywood where a certain kind of education seems useless or nil.</p>
<p>I think there are writers talented enough to succeed without a lot of education. I'm not one of those. But education or no, there are no guarantees to this writing thing.</p>
<p>I'm leaving town. OK. Don't hate me. Too much.</p>
<p>I'm not trying to start something with this, or continue it, whatever. I'm an old lady with opinions and experiences, and yes, some of my experiences are also in Hollywood where a certain kind of education seems useless or nil.</p>
<p>I think there are writers talented enough to succeed without a lot of education. I'm not one of those. But education or no, there are no guarantees to this writing thing.</p>
<p>I'm leaving town. OK. Don't hate me. Too much.</p>