Crime as 20th Century Entertainment - CrimeSpace2024-03-29T07:45:35Zhttps://crimespace.ning.com/forum/topics/537324:Topic:107463?commentId=537324%3AComment%3A109073&feed=yes&xn_auth=noYou have some lovely quotes a…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-30:537324:Comment:1090732007-12-30T19:20:02.412ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
You have some lovely quotes at your fingertips, Angela. I agree with both.<br />
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I don't write about my own time. That gives me the freedom to deal with the human condition as another time may have affected it. Human nature does not change, but how we cope has to change with circumstances. I've always been fascinated by how people used to deal with their surroundings. Their courage is inspiring. And their misdeeds were born from the same instincts that inspire modern crime.<br />
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The second quote deals…
You have some lovely quotes at your fingertips, Angela. I agree with both.<br />
<br />
I don't write about my own time. That gives me the freedom to deal with the human condition as another time may have affected it. Human nature does not change, but how we cope has to change with circumstances. I've always been fascinated by how people used to deal with their surroundings. Their courage is inspiring. And their misdeeds were born from the same instincts that inspire modern crime.<br />
<br />
The second quote deals with authorial manipulation of material in order the create effects. Reality tends to be boring, except for the occasional shocking event.<br />
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That Benazir Bhutto was assassinated was a momentary shock for most Americans. And an opportunity for TV reporters to discuss ad infinitum the political impact with much repetition of previous information.<br />
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I wanted to know about her background, her family history, who paid for her father's mausoleum (another Taj Mahal), and what exactly inspired her to take such risks at such a turbulent moment. I'm afraid I have to guess at those, for her own words were those of the politician running for office.<br />
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Oh, and I wonder what raised this one Muslim woman to such power in a society that traditionally keeps women as chattel. Her class/wealth? How wise that writer was! In…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-30:537324:Comment:1090562007-12-30T18:40:19.535ZSue Dawsonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/SueDawson
How wise that writer was! In my mind's eye I see some person on a dig in the future who finds<br />
a CD or DVD that he cannot play because the technology of his time will be so far advanced. Perhaps there will some sort of electronic Rosetta Stone unearthed to help him learn about the 21st Century.
How wise that writer was! In my mind's eye I see some person on a dig in the future who finds<br />
a CD or DVD that he cannot play because the technology of his time will be so far advanced. Perhaps there will some sort of electronic Rosetta Stone unearthed to help him learn about the 21st Century. 3. assumes that future genera…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-30:537324:Comment:1089792007-12-30T15:07:45.623ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
3. assumes that future generations will read our books. Judging from early mysteries that still sell well, this is a very dubious assumption.<br />
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There are times when I doubt that future generations will "read."<br />
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What constitutes "our world" in most genre novels is not necessarily factual -- or honest.
3. assumes that future generations will read our books. Judging from early mysteries that still sell well, this is a very dubious assumption.<br />
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There are times when I doubt that future generations will "read."<br />
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What constitutes "our world" in most genre novels is not necessarily factual -- or honest. Wow, thanks! That means a lot.tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1087652007-12-29T21:56:53.418ZJohn Dishonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/whiteskwirl
Wow, thanks! That means a lot.
Wow, thanks! That means a lot. At the risk of having this al…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086672007-12-29T18:35:27.304ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
At the risk of having this also pop up somewhere later where it makes absolutely no sense:<br />
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Re: personal experience and its importance in crime novels<br />
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Never underestimate imagination. In fact, I take an author's vivid imagination over his technical knowhow any day.
At the risk of having this also pop up somewhere later where it makes absolutely no sense:<br />
<br />
Re: personal experience and its importance in crime novels<br />
<br />
Never underestimate imagination. In fact, I take an author's vivid imagination over his technical knowhow any day. I enjoy many kinds of crime n…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086562007-12-29T17:58:24.377ZSue Dawsonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/SueDawson
I enjoy many kinds of crime novels, but I prefer those that have "flawed" heroes/heroines because nobody is perfect. I prefer reading series mysteries rather than a single novel that stands alone. Of course, all series have begun with the first book. Robert B. Parker's Spenser series started with a first novel as have all series that have stood the test of time. Right now I am listening to T IS FOR TRESPASS by Sue Grafton whose Kinsey Millhone is certainly "flawed." In my opinion "human" =…
I enjoy many kinds of crime novels, but I prefer those that have "flawed" heroes/heroines because nobody is perfect. I prefer reading series mysteries rather than a single novel that stands alone. Of course, all series have begun with the first book. Robert B. Parker's Spenser series started with a first novel as have all series that have stood the test of time. Right now I am listening to T IS FOR TRESPASS by Sue Grafton whose Kinsey Millhone is certainly "flawed." In my opinion "human" = "flawed." I gravitate toward strong protagonists with feet of clay. My late husband enjoyed what he termed "Bim-Bam, Thank you, Mam" novels (not sure how to spell the genre) with lots of action, but he never missed reading a new Stephanie Plum novel either. We both enjoyed novels with a bit of humor, and he loved Stephanie's grandmother's antics. He had, in his younger days, been an undercover narcotics agent but that did not keep him from enjoying fictional crime fighters.' Yeah, that's all true. The ma…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086342007-12-29T16:51:21.023ZJohn McFetridgehttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JohnMcF
Yeah, that's all true. The majority of writers don't have personal experience with the eventsthey write about, but they may have a connection to the emotions of what they write about - in every genre, even literary.<br />
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By the way, I really recommend the book, "Faking It." it's about music but it presents some challenging ideas about the search for authenticity in art. The authors make some good arguments that we often accept some art as genuine and authentic when it really isn't. I would say in…
Yeah, that's all true. The majority of writers don't have personal experience with the eventsthey write about, but they may have a connection to the emotions of what they write about - in every genre, even literary.<br />
<br />
By the way, I really recommend the book, "Faking It." it's about music but it presents some challenging ideas about the search for authenticity in art. The authors make some good arguments that we often accept some art as genuine and authentic when it really isn't. I would say in novels, we often give 'literary' books an easier ride in the genuine/authentic test, especially if they are set in foreign lands that we don't really know that much about, but have no problem projecting our views on.<br />
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And as for how many of us are affected by crimes and scams, that would really depend on how we define crime. To use your terrorist example, some in the world believe that all of us in North America benefit from the actions of our criminal leaders and we're just as culpable. Of course, no one would expect too many crime novels to reflect that, but the recent Ian Rankin novels, for example, do a good job of asking the questions.<br />
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I didn't really want this to get into another pointless genre vs. literary discussion. For myself, I've finally come up with a definition that works: literary novels are those by writers whose day jobs are almost exclusively in academia and genre novels are those by authors whose day jobs are in a wide variety of fields. Example: R.D.Wingfield's Fros…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086212007-12-29T16:07:49.961ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
Example: R.D.Wingfield's Frost novel where the protagonist struggles with his wife's final days. He had been about to divorce her when she was diagnosed with cancer and, instead of walking away, he took on her care. And yes, this is a crime novel.<br />
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A slightly different take: Hillerman's Navajo policeman lost his wife to cancer and wakes up every morning reaching across the empty bed for her.<br />
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The crime novel is incredibly enriched by such glimpses of the human condition.
Example: R.D.Wingfield's Frost novel where the protagonist struggles with his wife's final days. He had been about to divorce her when she was diagnosed with cancer and, instead of walking away, he took on her care. And yes, this is a crime novel.<br />
<br />
A slightly different take: Hillerman's Navajo policeman lost his wife to cancer and wakes up every morning reaching across the empty bed for her.<br />
<br />
The crime novel is incredibly enriched by such glimpses of the human condition. I think that dog belongs to l…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086182007-12-29T16:00:21.441ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
I think that dog belongs to leather daddy's better half. He probably carries her purse for her, too.
I think that dog belongs to leather daddy's better half. He probably carries her purse for her, too. I agree with John. Perhaps th…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2007-12-29:537324:Comment:1086142007-12-29T15:57:54.335ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
I agree with John. Perhaps the example of the stolen car vs. the lovemaking of two human beings was not the best example, but he is absolutely right that the impact of an event on the human condition is far more memorable (and important) than a random crime.<br />
The reason crime fiction so often fails to survive is that the cleverness of the plot or the twist or the premise is the only thing the book has going for it. People can talk about that at social gatherings. That sells books. But we read…
I agree with John. Perhaps the example of the stolen car vs. the lovemaking of two human beings was not the best example, but he is absolutely right that the impact of an event on the human condition is far more memorable (and important) than a random crime.<br />
The reason crime fiction so often fails to survive is that the cleverness of the plot or the twist or the premise is the only thing the book has going for it. People can talk about that at social gatherings. That sells books. But we read books alone. Often we are engaged by characters in the books in such a way that our lives are enriched. That is something we rarely talk about, perhaps because we assume that others wouldn't get it and maybe laugh at us.<br />
I'm glad John is here.