Love and Death: Is There ANYthing Else to Write About? - CrimeSpace2024-03-29T13:47:10Zhttps://crimespace.ning.com/forum/topics/love-and-death-is-there-anything-else-to-write-about?feed=yes&xn_auth=noDoesn't it usually work like…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3451872012-06-08T13:13:25.669ZJohn McFetridgehttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JohnMcF
<p>Doesn't it usually work like that, though? The better the art the messier the artist.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Doesn't it usually work like that, though? The better the art the messier the artist.</p>
<p> </p> I'm fairly sure lit fic is su…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3450632012-06-08T03:05:28.133ZEric Christophersonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/datahog
<p>I'm fairly sure lit fic is supposed to be character driven, but definitely not plot driven. Of course some of it does end up being style over substance. More often IMO it ends up being substance over story telling. :)</p>
<p>I'm fairly sure lit fic is supposed to be character driven, but definitely not plot driven. Of course some of it does end up being style over substance. More often IMO it ends up being substance over story telling. :)</p> Yeah, you're probably right.…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3451812012-06-08T02:58:39.865ZCammy May Hunnicutthttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>Yeah, you're probably right.</p>
<p>I guess I'm off-stride because I've been reading so much good stuff lately, and all the "lit lit" stuff I see is just so crushingly boring.</p>
<p></p>
<p>But isn't the whole thing about "literary" that it's not plot or character driven, just all about the writing? So doesn't that sound like style over substance?</p>
<p>Yeah, you're probably right.</p>
<p>I guess I'm off-stride because I've been reading so much good stuff lately, and all the "lit lit" stuff I see is just so crushingly boring.</p>
<p></p>
<p>But isn't the whole thing about "literary" that it's not plot or character driven, just all about the writing? So doesn't that sound like style over substance?</p> I'd say the best of so-called…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3451802012-06-08T02:46:01.609ZEric Christophersonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/datahog
<p>I'd say the best of so-called genre fiction has as much substance as your average lit fic book. Most genre fiction, for example, has no theme beyond the banal and characterization is typically far more complex in lit fiction. I say this as a person who writes genre fiction and reads it in favor of lit fic in a ratio of at least ten to one.</p>
<p>I'd say the best of so-called genre fiction has as much substance as your average lit fic book. Most genre fiction, for example, has no theme beyond the banal and characterization is typically far more complex in lit fiction. I say this as a person who writes genre fiction and reads it in favor of lit fic in a ratio of at least ten to one.</p> Sorry, John, but I kind of se…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3449302012-06-08T02:20:48.379ZCammy May Hunnicutthttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/CammyMayHunnicutt
<p>Sorry, John, but I kind of see more substance in genres than literary fiction. It's kind of like anybody can pour sauce over something, but good fried chicken takes some know-how and sticks to your ribs.</p>
<p>Sorry, John, but I kind of see more substance in genres than literary fiction. It's kind of like anybody can pour sauce over something, but good fried chicken takes some know-how and sticks to your ribs.</p> Those insights into character…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3449972012-06-08T02:19:57.711ZEric Christophersonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/datahog
<p>Those insights into characters and yet Cheever, personally, was a mess. Funny how that works.</p>
<p>Those insights into characters and yet Cheever, personally, was a mess. Funny how that works.</p> Well with crime fiction a dea…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-08:537324:Comment:3451772012-06-08T02:16:21.807ZEric Christophersonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/datahog
<p>Well with crime fiction a death often provides the structure, but as Robert B. Parker once said: </p>
<p>“The plot is the line on which I hang the wash, and the wash is what I care about.”</p>
<p>Well with crime fiction a death often provides the structure, but as Robert B. Parker once said: </p>
<p>“The plot is the line on which I hang the wash, and the wash is what I care about.”</p> :) I love it when critics qu…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-07:537324:Comment:3451572012-06-07T18:07:19.452ZI. J. Parkerhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Ingpark
<p>:) I love it when critics quote.</p>
<p>:) I love it when critics quote.</p> I am sure it can be taken out…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-07:537324:Comment:3449792012-06-07T14:04:31.746ZJonathan Francescohttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JonathanFrancesco
<p>I am sure it can be taken out. Never denied that. Yet, even if you skip over the scenes with the violence, violence is still a part of the plot. I arrange it in terms of tiers. Violence can be taken out often, sex can be taken out even more often. Love/caring is the only thing I feel you'll have a hard time taking out and still having a story left. So of the three (love, sex, and death), I feel love THE most essential. </p>
<p>I am sure it can be taken out. Never denied that. Yet, even if you skip over the scenes with the violence, violence is still a part of the plot. I arrange it in terms of tiers. Violence can be taken out often, sex can be taken out even more often. Love/caring is the only thing I feel you'll have a hard time taking out and still having a story left. So of the three (love, sex, and death), I feel love THE most essential. </p> Violence can be taken out mor…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2012-06-07:537324:Comment:3451472012-06-07T13:56:42.445ZDana Kinghttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/DanaKing
<p>Violence can be taken out more often than most think. Higgins made a living not describing things and keeping the reader in the loop through conversations taking place after the fact. Our own John McFetridge does this very well in SWAP (LET IT RIDE everywhere but the US), leading us up to a police raid on a biker headquarters, then skipping the raid itself,letting us find out what happened by listening to both sides talk about it later.</p>
<p>Violence can be taken out more often than most think. Higgins made a living not describing things and keeping the reader in the loop through conversations taking place after the fact. Our own John McFetridge does this very well in SWAP (LET IT RIDE everywhere but the US), leading us up to a police raid on a biker headquarters, then skipping the raid itself,letting us find out what happened by listening to both sides talk about it later.</p>