objectivity - CrimeSpace2024-03-29T13:47:25Zhttps://crimespace.ning.com/forum/topics/objectivity-1?commentId=537324%3AComment%3A187638&feed=yes&xn_auth=noThat is why I love critique g…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-14:537324:Comment:1880212009-03-14T17:28:42.405ZChristine Duncanhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/ChristineDuncan
That is why I love critique groups! Seriously, I know that sometimes I'll read something I've written and it will nag at me but I won't quite know why. Another eye --or 3 or 4 helps.
That is why I love critique groups! Seriously, I know that sometimes I'll read something I've written and it will nag at me but I won't quite know why. Another eye --or 3 or 4 helps. Like others here, I found an…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-13:537324:Comment:1877892009-03-13T14:11:58.112ZJohn Desjarlaishttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JohnDesjarlais
Like others here, I found an honest reader who said what was junk and what was working regarding a work-in-progress. I found two different readers to look over the entire manuscript when it was in good shape, since the reader who looked at pieces along the way was (she admitted) no longer objective and had a hard time seeing the big picture, having seen all the pieces as they were produced.
Like others here, I found an honest reader who said what was junk and what was working regarding a work-in-progress. I found two different readers to look over the entire manuscript when it was in good shape, since the reader who looked at pieces along the way was (she admitted) no longer objective and had a hard time seeing the big picture, having seen all the pieces as they were produced. I 'beta read' other author's…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-13:537324:Comment:1877242009-03-13T06:38:26.841ZBobhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Bob24
I 'beta read' other author's novels after a first or second draft. Ocassionally I will do this on unfinished work. It involves reading the manuscript and commenting according to the author's direction. On one'beta read' I did, the authors requested a brutal read with grammar, pace, content, plot and writing style comments. My comments on that work were over 9,000 words on the first ten chapters. At that point, I felt the authors had a firm grip on the editing required across the entire novel.…
I 'beta read' other author's novels after a first or second draft. Ocassionally I will do this on unfinished work. It involves reading the manuscript and commenting according to the author's direction. On one'beta read' I did, the authors requested a brutal read with grammar, pace, content, plot and writing style comments. My comments on that work were over 9,000 words on the first ten chapters. At that point, I felt the authors had a firm grip on the editing required across the entire novel. After they finished the edit, I did another read and was down to 100 words of comments. They were successful at getting an agent and last I heard, they were negotiating a publishing deal. OK, now, what exactly is a 'b…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-13:537324:Comment:1877002009-03-13T03:39:18.341ZminervaKhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/minervakoenig
OK, now, what exactly is a 'beta reader?' I've seen the term several places, and still am not sure exactly what the 'beta' refers to - M.
OK, now, what exactly is a 'beta reader?' I've seen the term several places, and still am not sure exactly what the 'beta' refers to - M. I do believe that I am mostly…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-13:537324:Comment:1876972009-03-13T03:34:07.346ZClair Dicksonhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/ClairDickson
I do believe that I am mostly objective about my own work at this point. Partly, I think because of my experiences with submitting for publications. I've have studied and learned the things that generally work well and those that don't.<br />
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I know that I can and do write crap. I write anyway, because you cannot revise what is not written.<br />
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I think that if a writer can separate themselves from their work, they will have a much easier time being objective. I can write crap without being a crappy…
I do believe that I am mostly objective about my own work at this point. Partly, I think because of my experiences with submitting for publications. I've have studied and learned the things that generally work well and those that don't.<br />
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I know that I can and do write crap. I write anyway, because you cannot revise what is not written.<br />
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I think that if a writer can separate themselves from their work, they will have a much easier time being objective. I can write crap without being a crappy writer. (I can always revise it. First drafts are very likely to be crap, or full of crap, or spotted with crap... um, eeeewwwww....)<br />
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For some people, they require taking time away from a manuscript. I feel I work better when I study what I've written, read it over and over without getting distracted by the story. The most important thing is to read critically.<br />
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One of the BEST things a writer can do... is have a good beta reader. A good beta-- who understands what you're trying to say and clubs you when you fail to say it well-- will server a writer well. I think few writers can become fully objective without much time and much growth. I think betas are great for growth as they will help you while you learn how to be a better writer. (I <3 my first beta reader. I'm so much of a better writer because of him. =) Having feedback can help you figure out what you do wrong, and give you confidence regarding what you do write. In my never humble opinion.<br />
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(Now, I've never had any ego problems regarding my writing, overall. Finding hats that fit... ;-) I agree that you can never be…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-13:537324:Comment:1876922009-03-13T03:18:47.937ZLaura L. Cooperhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/LauraLCooper
I agree that you can never be truly objective about your own work. But I think your editing skills grow along with your writing skills. The best thing I do for myself is to work on multiple projects at one time. Maybe start a few short stories along with a novel. That way I don't feel that someone's critique or rejection of one of my projects is all I have going at any one moment. (Thanks for the invite.)
I agree that you can never be truly objective about your own work. But I think your editing skills grow along with your writing skills. The best thing I do for myself is to work on multiple projects at one time. Maybe start a few short stories along with a novel. That way I don't feel that someone's critique or rejection of one of my projects is all I have going at any one moment. (Thanks for the invite.) Ya know, now that y'all menti…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-12:537324:Comment:1876492009-03-12T23:58:28.446ZminervaKhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/minervakoenig
Ya know, now that y'all mention it, I had a hiatus of a couple of weeks away from The Book not too long ago, and when I got back to work on it again, I seemed to see it more clearly. So that 'letting it rest' thing sounds right.<br />
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I think the hardest thing, for me, is believing what I think about my own work. I expect that gets better with experience, too.<br />
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Out of curiosity, how/where does one round up objective readers/critics? I'd be very interested in having anyone here who'd like to read a…
Ya know, now that y'all mention it, I had a hiatus of a couple of weeks away from The Book not too long ago, and when I got back to work on it again, I seemed to see it more clearly. So that 'letting it rest' thing sounds right.<br />
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I think the hardest thing, for me, is believing what I think about my own work. I expect that gets better with experience, too.<br />
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Out of curiosity, how/where does one round up objective readers/critics? I'd be very interested in having anyone here who'd like to read a couple of my chapters and give me some feedback. Leave a note on my page or at my blog (<a href="http://www.minervakoenig.com">www.minervakoenig.com</a>)...<br />
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MK Time away from it is the only…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-12:537324:Comment:1876382009-03-12T23:06:23.482ZPepper Smithhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Reefrunner
Time away from it is the only way to gain any real objectivity about your own work. While you've got it sitting in a drawer somewhere, start working on the next story, so you won't feel so much like you're just sitting on your hands.<br />
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Personally, if I want to be as objective as possible, I have to set something aside for a minimum of at least a year, preferably two, long enough that I forget the words and the rhythms of what I wrote. It can be a startling experience. It's the only time I really…
Time away from it is the only way to gain any real objectivity about your own work. While you've got it sitting in a drawer somewhere, start working on the next story, so you won't feel so much like you're just sitting on your hands.<br />
<br />
Personally, if I want to be as objective as possible, I have to set something aside for a minimum of at least a year, preferably two, long enough that I forget the words and the rhythms of what I wrote. It can be a startling experience. It's the only time I really hear my voice as a writer. A common saying for writers i…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-12:537324:Comment:1876232009-03-12T22:13:40.334ZBobhttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/Bob24
A common saying for writers is "You have to pay your dues, a million words written, before you gain a little confidence in your work."
A common saying for writers is "You have to pay your dues, a million words written, before you gain a little confidence in your work." I don't think you can ever be…tag:crimespace.ning.com,2009-03-12:537324:Comment:1876202009-03-12T22:00:01.966ZJack Getzehttps://crimespace.ning.com/profile/JGetze
I don't think you can ever be totally objective about your own work. Like other aspects of craft, you use your tools -- in this case, time, critique groups, readers, reading the work out loud -- and keep improving.
I don't think you can ever be totally objective about your own work. Like other aspects of craft, you use your tools -- in this case, time, critique groups, readers, reading the work out loud -- and keep improving.